Photo by Kate Milford
Clay Risen is the author of the new book Red Scare: Blacklists, McCarthyism, and the Making of Modern America. His other books include The Crowded Hour. He is a reporter and editor at The New York Times, and he lives in Brooklyn.
Q: What inspired you to write Red Scare?
A: I’ve written several other books and articles about postwar America, and at a certain point I realized that the Red Scare was everywhere, even when it wasn’t mentioned – sort of a political dark matter, if you will.
The fears generated by the Red Scare lasted long after it ended; just take as an example the way Lyndon Johnson refused to back out of the Vietnam out of fear that he would be considered weak on communism.
But I also realized that it had been a long time since anyone had assessed the Red Scare head on, and that a book that gathered all the new materials and research on the topic over the last 25 years might be a good idea.
Q: What would you say are some of the most common perceptions and misconceptions about the Red Scare?
A: The main thing is that people associate it almost exclusively with Sen. Joe McCarthy and his time in the political spotlight, from 1950 to 1954. This is true even when they know about other signal events of the era, like the Hollywood Blacklist or the Rosenbergs’ trial.
They also think about it as a phenomenon largely limited to Washington, and maybe Los Angeles, when in fact it was also a grassroots mania that shaped everyday life far beyond America’s power centers.
Q: The writer Todd S. Purdum said of the book, “[A] sweeping portrait of a nightmare moment when America lost its faith in itself is a vivid reminder of what happens when we trade our founding ideals for easy answers and false security. It's a troubling parable for our own perilous times.” What do you think of that description?
A: Well, I liked it enough to put it on my dust jacket! I certainly agree with it. While there has been a lot of talk around the book and the parallels between the Red Scare era and today, my underlying point was intended to be a more timeless one – namely, that there is a fine line between security and liberty, and we do ourselves a great and dangerous disservice when we allow the former to impinge on the latter.
Q: How did you research the book, and did you learn anything that especially surprised you?
A: I had intended to do most of my research in archives, and I did get a lot done. But the pandemic came along just as I was planning a number of big trips, and it shut down access to archives for the better part of two years.
I could do a good amount of work online, and there were ways around some of the restrictions – like hiring students, who were allowed into university libraries even when I wasn’t. But still, it was not a great time for intense archival work.
That said, I did learn a lot from the archives. One thing that surprised me was a series of folders I found in the archives of the Hoover Institution at Stanford. They detailed the mechanics of how the Hollywood Blacklist worked – it was an informal system, but also quite rigorous. It took dedicated gatekeepers and a tight network of enforcers. I’ll leave it to the reader to discover just how it operated.
Q: What are you working on now?
A: My next book is very different – a dual biography of two whiskey “barons” in the 19th century whose warring interests helped shape a surprising range of progressive-era innovations, from antitrust law to the Pure Food and Drug Act.
Q: Anything else we should know?
A: I suppose I would add that the Red Scare continues to shape our politics and culture, not only in catchphrases like “are you or have you ever been,” but in the deep distrust it engendered in government, as well as in people we disagree with.
The Red Scare isn’t the only reason why were are living through a period of intense polarization and political hatred, but I don’t think we can understand where we are without grappling with that era.
--Interview with Deborah Kalb
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